Evilness with EOE & PS

[taco_salad]

here is something evil some people started to do today in alliance battles. They form a party of suiciders and cast EOE and Predatory Season. Then kill themselves to kill spike that one side. Well this causes a bug that stops the rez of the whole kurzick side for some reason, and lets the luxons win without any fighting.


I dunno about you, but isn't a game suposed to be about playing?

I reported it but my reports never go through so....anyone know how to stop this?? I mean in 2 hours the luxons pushed out of their town and into the heart of HzH!

[Kijik Oni Hanryuu]

lol the kurzicks screwed themselves over comitting SUICIDE no less......silly little emos

[Arturo02]

report anyone who does this and take screenshots. They have to be using two accounts to do this and technically it is not legal to do so under the same isp. It's right in the user agreement.

[Shadow-Hunter]

Why do they have to use 2 Accs to do this??

~Shadow

[Pawn]

they could be doing it for laughs and how would killing your own team be faction farming i think its hilarious

[Sarevok Thordin]

yeah I just heard about this.

Someone is gonna get it for that......

[Kaguya]

report anyone who does this and take screenshots. They have to be using two accounts to do this and technically it is not legal to do so under the same isp. It's right in the user agreement.
Why they need to be having two accounts? And where in EULA does it forbid connecting more than one client from single IP?

That kind of restricition would make netcafes, dorms, aparments with shared internet connections etc EULA breaking.

[taco_salad]

even then they could be just a group of friends who want to see luxons push into kurzick's land

[Arturo02]

Why they need to be having two accounts? And where in EULA does it forbid connecting more than one client from single IP?

That kind of restricition would make netcafes, dorms, aparments with shared internet connections etc EULA breaking.

I have to apologize as I usually do when I am wrong. I read through the User Agreement several times and did not find anything about what I stated earlier. But the person who told me is a reliable source and I am going to ask them where they saw it.

But I still stand by what I said about reporting them. While there is a legal right to use the skills in combat, it completely ruins competition if it is allowed to happen BEFORE the match even begins. So the more people that report, the better chance we have to stop the cheating. You can't have alliance battles with this going on, it kills the whole concept.

As for using a second account, it has been my experience people tend to use second accounts for exploits and this coincidentally comes at the same time the attention is on the free trial accounts. Also, it's a double faction weekend so wouldn't be very hard to build up enough faction to unlock eoe and anything to help you kill yourself.

But they could use their main accounts if they wanted to.

At least I admitted I was wrong. :)

[Ecksor]

I still don't see how people can report you for Sacrificing yourself to death when EoE happens to be up. When you look at it that way, you're really just reporting the bug that you don't get ressed after everyone dies.

[Kaguya]

I still don't see how people can report you for Sacrificing yourself to death when EoE happens to be up. When you look at it that way, you're really just reporting the bug that you don't get ressed after everyone dies.
Killing yourself is fine, but intentionally killing the whole team so that they effectively can't play is griefing, which is against the EULA thus could warrant a ban.

Hope they fix the bug, goes along the same sillyness as the Aspenwood and Unyielding Aura-bug :mad:

[Arturo02]

I still don't see how people can report you for Sacrificing yourself to death when EoE happens to be up. When you look at it that way, you're really just reporting the bug that you don't get ressed after everyone dies.

if it happened in the field of play fine. I can deal with that. But not before you even get a chance to fight. The timer to start the match still shows 30 seconds yet our team is dead. Eoe didn't 'happen' to be up, it was done intentionally to give the other side an unfair advantage. There is no reason to cast eoe in your home base unless you want to kill the team. You obviously don't know the mechanics of the issue.

And even if the rez bug was fixed the person would just suicide again. The issue is not the rez bug. The whole thing is an exploit, a way to use legal game mechanics to cheat. That is not fair in any way and it kills games. Just ask anyone who played UO.

That said I didn't see any eoe tonight so the problem has been addressed. So refreshing to play a game where they take care of exploits even on the weekends. :)

[TheOneMephisto]

Still not understanding how it's against the ULA. It's griefing sure, but do runners in RA get bans for griefing? Unless it's like luxons coming over to the Kurzick side to do it, but I'm betting that it's just teams of friends doing it for shits and giggles.

[Kaguya]

Still not understanding how it's against the ULA. It's griefing sure, but do runners in RA get bans for griefing?
You will not exploit any bug in Guild Wars and you will not communicate the existence of any such exploitable bug (bugs that grant the user unnatural or unintended benefits) either directly or through public posting, to any other user of Guild Wars.
They are abusing a bug that prevents your teammates from respawning, thus violating the rule. Thenagain, we are breaking the said rule by discussing it here. :p

While playing Guild Wars, you must respect the rights of others and their rights to play and enjoy the game. To this end, you may not defraud, harass, threaten, or cause distress and/or unwanted attention to other players.
RoC #1 is a bit unclear, the are in a way breaking it, but thenagain they aren't. It's all about point of view.

[Aejorii]

Unless it's like luxons coming over to the Kurzick side to do it, but I'm betting that it's just teams of friends doing it for shits and giggles.
This is it.

[Kijik Oni Hanryuu]

it happened to me today, and I now know that it was a kurzick spy team, they EoE bombed the luxon side, then left and then the kurzick team started laughing about it saying how sneaky they were, this is a malicious thing, not just fun and game anymore, the buttholes bombed us then leftus with an 8V12

[dgb]

RoC #1 is a bit unclear, the are in a way breaking it, but thenagain they aren't. It's all about point of view.

It's also utterly inane. If I wanted to I could construe every PVP match to have something breaking it. That warrior just unloading an eviscerate to me is distressing, BAN!

[JoDiamonds]

Griefing is a shade of gray.

Runners in RA can at least claim they are potentially still trying to win. Running (temporarily) is clearly a viable tactic at least some of the time, so it's not always entirely clear why someone is currently running. (But it's a pretty good instinct to run away from four enemies anyway).

Killing your own whole team before play even begins is clearly not beneficial to anyone, and requires that you setup a team with EoE and self-sacrifice skills. This is obviously pre-meditated griefing and clearly against the user agreement.

You could try to be weasely and more technical and keep arguing about it, but I doubt that Arena Net would see it any other way (especially if people take screen shots and report you).

[TheMadKingGeorge]

im gonna do it and im gonna say get better monks

[richirich]

tut tut typical luxon behaviour :P j/k...but seriously it should be fixed its like the bug that killed the holding team in hoh by yet again eoe..dunno how they fix this one though negate the effects of all spirits before the timer starts?

[Former Ruling]

"Griefing" by in large is not clearly prohibited in the Rules of Conduct, and I have yet to see a case of someone getting suspended (they don't ban you for small stuff like running in RA...) for such action.

My point: Anet can twist anything they want into being suspend-worthy, but from past experiences, they have not.

There is no exploitable bug in the process so you cannot go that route. Both during and after the bombing. EoE and saccing to cause the "bombing" effect has been a valid and somewhat useful strategy for ages. The no rezzing during the countdown (and for ~1 minute afterwards) is not a "bug" - lest it woulda been fixed ages before EoE became popular. It is most probably to stop the creation of "minion factory" tactics on a large scale. IE: For the cost of ~20 points at the start, you can STEAMROLL all the cap points. My Point basically is..If EoE bombing your team was such a HUGGEEEEE Instant Ban-able bug they woulda taken it out days ago. Now There are no less than about 10 different teams that do it on a constant basis. If you remember the TeamKill in arenas bug (which WAS a bug) they removed that before the masses even knew really how it was being done. There was like a tight group of 2-3 guys that were doing it constantly.

What I DO agree with from a Sane Prospective:
Anet will probably remove the no rez at the start clause in Allaince Battles if they think it is fit. The better (And probably more likely) solution is that they will not allow Points to be given before the timer starts. That would destroy the bomber's whole reason of doing it, as then all that would happen is some of the team would have to wait a minute to join the fight (you DO rez after the timer starts, theres just like a minute delay) - which barely effects the game.

As for ways of stoppin it...it is DUMBLY Simple to make it on a whole not effective.

1) There are about 5 ritualist skills that totally stop it in its tracks before it even starts. This is the biggest Crusher.
2) On the Saltspray Beach map, you CAN get out of EoE's range, the starting spot is very wide, and about 1/3 of it cannot be covered by one EoE. This is specific to that one map.
3) This is the EASIEST way and requries no changing of teams. You have Monks and MM's on your 12 man team right? Easiest way spread the EoEs...HEAL THE BOMBERS. 1 MM heal area'ing the bombers will drag the bomb sessions out a long enough time that monks can fully heal any dmg. 2 Heal Areas on the bombers almost totally destroys its chances of killing anything. 1 Monk that is worth his weight can keep up 1-2 saccers through their sacs...which also destroys the bomb.

[Dasensai]

Anet will probably remove the no rez at the start clause in Allaince Battles if they think it is fit. The better (And probably more likely) solution is that they will not allow Points to be given before the timer starts. That would destroy the bomber's whole reason of doing it, as then all that would happen is some of the team would have to wait a minute to join the fight (you DO rez after the timer starts, theres just like a minute delay) - which barely effects the game.

The reason the bombers do it is because its funny to see the reactions of everybody in local chat. People thinking its spies from the other team, calling the other team hackers, people giving the bombers their home address so they can meet in real life and fight etc. If you really want to get people to stop bombing, just stop saying hillarious stuff in the local chat.


3) This is the EASIEST way and requries no changing of teams. You have Monks and MM's on your 12 man team right? Easiest way spread the EoEs...HEAL THE BOMBERS. 1 MM heal area'ing the bombers will drag the bomb sessions out a long enough time that monks can fully heal any dmg. 2 Heal Areas on the bombers almost totally destroys its chances of killing anything. 1 Monk that is worth his weight can keep up 1-2 saccers through their sacs...which also destroys the bomb.

How do you expect to out heal Blood is Power? The bombers also bring Predatory Season which cuts down on healing.

[Ill_bet_you_hate_me]

Hello, I was one of the Kurzicks running Sacrafice EoE bomb in Ab. I am pretty sure you are talking about us, we ran the suicide bomb for about 4 hours tonight (or I suppost last night by now). I would like to state here that A) this is a build that desperatly needs to be nerfed, B) I beleive there was nothing wrong with what we did as far as the rule are considered (let me make it clear, not from the a social perspective, what I am saying is that my team was [insert profanity here]) and C) Our purpose was divided between having fun (I must admit it to that, most definatly a guilty pleasure) and also to bring to the Anets attention this extremly abusive build. I am sorry for screwing up peoples fun for one night, but judging from the "I am reporting this" comments that we got every single time, I would assume that Anet will hear about this and, hopfully, nerf it in a timely fashion. Feel free to flame my pm box but please keep this thread orderly. Thank you, and sorry.

Also if I do get banned (hopfully not at all or at the very least for a short time) I will inform you via this thread.

[sir lockt]

im gonna do it and im gonna say get better monks

Strange thing about it its that when you keep your team alive...you are flamed for not having res...in AB... but you are correct...most eoe bombs are to sloppy and therefore perfectly healable...

[Spura]

I don't understand. So 4 man team sacrifises. EoE does 52 per death at max. That's 208 dmg. Shouldn't kill anyone else on the team.

[JoDiamonds]

Hello, I was one of the Kurzicks running Sacrafice EoE bomb in Ab. I am pretty sure you are talking about us, we ran the suicide bomb for about 4 hours tonight (or I suppost last night by now). I would like to state here that A) this is a build that desperatly needs to be nerfed, B) I beleive there was nothing wrong with what we did as far as the rule are considered (let me make it clear, not from the a social perspective, what I am saying is that my team was [insert profanity here]) and C) Our purpose was divided between having fun (I must admit it to that, most definatly a guilty pleasure) and also to bring to the Anets attention this extremly abusive build. I am sorry for screwing up peoples fun for one night, but judging from the "I am reporting this" comments that we got every single time, I would assume that Anet will hear about this and, hopfully, nerf it in a timely fashion. Feel free to flame my pm box but please keep this thread orderly. Thank you, and sorry.

Also if I do get banned (hopfully not at all or at the very least for a short time) I will inform you via this thread.

I'm glad you stated this. I do think this should be a bannable or suspendable offense -- "screwing up people's fun" is pretty much right in line with the definition of griefing.

Also, for anyone who thinks no one has been banned for griefing -- how would you know? The only people who know for sure are the people who are banned. And some of them do whine and complain, but I imagine most of them know they did something at least shady or wrong, and aren't going to be vocal about it. Especially if you are just suspended for a week or something like that.

I know I've reported people and not seen them again. Since there's a zillion guild wars players, that doesn't mean they were banned, just as much as it doesn't mean they weren't banned.

[Ill_bet_you_hate_me]

Wasn't banned. I would assume that if I havn't been by now, I am not going to be. The people who got so angery that they copied us would be at fault too by your logic and that would be too many people to ban. We were also not the very first to do this ether, so saying we were the absolute source would also be incorrect because we didn't come up with the idea to use eoe (it was some guild members friend). Instead all we did was figure out how to sacrafice 12 times per group and did it a lot. We were probably the most organized (we were all on ts calling every thing) and did it more then any one had before us, thusly making us the most annoying, but thats a weak case compaired to if we were the first or only people doing it, which we were nether. Not to say that I don't think the eoe bombs that popped up after us were not cause by us. We were just the ones to popularize the idea and build. Also this video should clear up questions as to how we did it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tgLs1MrUFCk

[Misc Merik]

As for ways of stoppin it...it is DUMBLY Simple to make it on a whole not effective.

1) There are about 5 ritualist skills that totally stop it in its tracks before it even starts. This is the biggest Crusher.
2) On the Saltspray Beach map, you CAN get out of EoE's range, the starting spot is very wide, and about 1/3 of it cannot be covered by one EoE. This is specific to that one map.
3) This is the EASIEST way and requries no changing of teams. You have Monks and MM's on your 12 man team right? Easiest way spread the EoEs...HEAL THE BOMBERS. 1 MM heal area'ing the bombers will drag the bomb sessions out a long enough time that monks can fully heal any dmg. 2 Heal Areas on the bombers almost totally destroys its chances of killing anything. 1 Monk that is worth his weight can keep up 1-2 saccers through their sacs...which also destroys the bomb.

I know its a counter but when things like this become necessary to stop a bunch of kids ruining the fun in AB something needs to be done on Anet's end to stop it.

[Kook~NBK~]

tut tut typical luxon behaviour :P j/k...but seriously it should be fixed its like the bug that killed the holding team in hoh by yet again eoe..dunno how they fix this one though negate the effects of all spirits before the timer starts?

Either that or disable all skills/spells during timer countdown.

[ogami_ito]

So let me get this straight. What this is a group of traiters on one side...say 4 players, who sacrifice themselves with eoe to order to kill the rest of the team-mates. And they did this for no purpose other than to piss others off?

Therefore, even if this traitor bombing was thwarted with heals, one team would be playing with a bunch of traitors. So probably could notwin anyway, right?

and one more thing...as they dont rez, how can this work? You would need to creat at least 9 or so deaths for this to work. That means they kill themselves, then rez the dead, then repeat?

[King's Spectre]

It was stated early on that a bug caused nobody to rez. I have no idea if it's really been fixed yet or not. You're right - any team with 4 traiters is doomed. What the bomb does is allow the other side side to win a game in 60 seconds. Enough of these and and you can really skew the win/loss total and move the lines.

So even if you stop the bomb, you have to choose between just quitting and giving the others a quick win or wasting 20 minutes of your time trying to hold a control point for the full duration.

At least until everybody quits playing AB.

[TheOneMephisto]

They managed to get off a lot of bombs by using lively is whatsherface (at least that's what I got from the movie). Apparently you guys would cast lively, sac, then 2 sec later would res, cast glyph of something, probably essence or sacrifice? then sac again, etc.

[Zenam]

Best way to do an EoE bomb by ureself in AB is to wait untill one side has many of the flags and rez points and if your playing Etnaren, drop EoE and move to another spot and drop Fertile Season. once you notice one or two people die use Feast of souls over Fertile spirit and KABAAM every 1 is dfead